October 03, 2007


Meanwhile, up the road a piece...

I might hafta mosey over and see what this fuss is all about:

Secessionists meeting in Tennessee
By Bill Poovey, Associated Press

CHATTANOOGA, Tenn. - In an unlikely marriage of desire to secede from the United States, two advocacy groups from opposite political traditions — New England and the South — are sitting down to talk.

Tired of foreign wars and what they consider right-wing courts, the Middlebury Institute wants liberal states like Vermont to be able to secede peacefully.

That sounds just fine to the League of the South, a conservative group that refuses to give up on Southern independence.

"We believe that an independent South, or Hawaii, Alaska, or Vermont would be better able to serve the interest of everybody, regardless of race or ethnicity," said Michael Hill of Killen, Ala., president of the League of the South...(read more)

Killen, huh? Perhaps the vice-president is from Lynchburg (rrrummpish!). And this is the first I've heard of northern leftists that are pushing for secession. I always figured those pinko pansies would opt for the "leave it" part of the old two-part "America:" slogan.

But seriously, that this is happening right down the road is titillating. I've had passing "what ifs?" on this subject through the years, but I wasn't aware of any concerted effort beyond some weak bumper sticker aphorisms. But reading this I must say I can see how this scenario is becoming less and less of an ideological pipe dream and more and more a distinct possibility, given the current polarized state of affairs here. Libertarians have been working on a similar separatist tack on a minimized electoral basis (I didn't dig in to see how well it was going but my guess would be "not particularly").

Could an ideologically divided United States of America work? It seems to me that the shaky ground right off the bat would be in the implementation of national defense. Certainly there would have to be some sort of non-aggression pact in place to keep the peace between states, but is that something that could stand the test of time and it's changing political winds? What about trade? Or labor? Immigration?

So I'm seriously considering a trip downtown this week, assuming the secessionists might have some answers or at least food for thought. My ideological appetite would of course be more aroused by the tofu of the pointy-headed liberals than by the greasy barbecue of the good old boys, but I'm open-minded. I've never considered states rights to be a bad thing - the founders set up the constitution that way for a reason, and one of those was surely so that differing regions could adjust their structure of government to best suit the purposes of their peoples. The concept has indeed gotten a bad rap for its association with southern racist/secession thinking (if you can call it that). As the University of North Carolina history professor says in the article, it's a surprise to see the liberals conferring with the League of the South, "an organization that's associated with a cause that many of us associate with the preservation of slavery."

My gut feeling is that these two groups are likely just too fringe-y to accomplish anything, but that they have come so far as to gather and talk is enough to gain my interest.

UPDATE: Unfortunately I wasn't able to make it to the conference, but here is the article from the Chattanooga Times-Free Press.

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Secession schmecession. If the union were to dissolve into 50 children like some catholic family suddenly found parentless, it wouldn't really make much difference out here. I mean, we already provide most of the technology, entertainment, food, and tax dollars for the rest of you lazy bastards. Splitting off would actually mean more for us.

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of an independent California Republic.

Ook ook
Don't worry, California will split off on its own eventually.

"I always figured those pinko pansies would opt for the "leave it" part of the old two-part "America:" slogan."

They are, but they've put a lot of work into those nice yards, and would like to take them with.
Much as I like the idea of the far right and far left coming together to mess stuff up, I have to agree with the Fez Monkey.

And I'm probably the only member of the "loony left" not to get all pissed off about Jack Kingston. I'm sorry for my Southern brethren and sistren who have to leave near these animals, but the majority of the South voted for these cretins to do EXACTLY what Kingston did. Waste Congressional time praising Rush Limbaugh. What? You were expecting him to introduce a resolution making Keith Olbermann a "national treasure"?

The only people this would benefit are the Blue Staters who would keep their disproportionate share of the tax revenue. The Red States might be able to put their more retrograde social customs into legal effect but that's all they'd get. It would become a loose confederation of 3rd world principalities. Why should they give up their dominant position in American politics for that? The other losers would be the USA Republican party. They are not going to give up 50% of their electorate. More losers still in this deal would be beautiful folk like O'TIM and D-CUP/MATHMAN who would have no help from a national Democratic Party and would have to live under theocratic rule.

The Union fought a war to keep the Republic together. The Confederacy fought for the next 150 years to reclaim control of that Republic and they are not giving up with out a far bloodier fight.

Some years ago there were T-shirts and coffee mugs and posters with a redrawn map of the continent showing two countries: THE DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF CANADA and JESUSLAND. It didn't seem so bad. As a former Northeastern American, that didn't seem so bad, and neither does this, but it cannot possibly happen.

New York City has tried it. The borough of Staten Island has tried it. Washington, DC has tried it. All without even one whisper of success.
You are correct Fez, and Joe may be even correcter with regards to beachfront property in Fresno.

And of course Kelso's is correct in pointing out that secession is the penultimate longshot. My saying that it is becoming more of a distinct possibility is disingenuous - really just blog rambling. But hey that's what we're here for, no?

Indeed I had not considered the effects on and of the liberal urban centers. Pick one of several united states - Illinois, Georgia - where the large urban center blends the rural red into various shades of purple (Hey there's your boy Obama, Kelso!). Well okay, the Georgia state house is rather crimson these days, but Tennessee is hanging on to its magenta-ness with fierce determination (dang that Nashville ).

And as my own personal situation would be a prime example, unless your going to organize a massive relocation program (because I have no truck with Southern Independicists), the majority will just laugh at the thought of secession. I think Kelso's advice of having an up-to-date passport is more pragmatic.
Funny enough, an American guy i spoke to a while back seemed to think California was going to split from the rest of the USA. He also thought Texas and Florida. I have no idea if his and Joes words will come true but i did notice at the last election voting map, the left and right side of the country were one colour (Kerry) and through the centre another (Bush).
That map is a more detailed account of the t-shirts to which Kelso referred. The "THE DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF CANADA" included the west and upper east coasts of the "former" U.S., while "JESUSLAND" was the south and all the rural "flyover" states.

Texas has always had its swaggering "we're big enough to be our own country" thing going since it was essentially that (stolen from Mexico) before becoming a state. It's the same attitude the Chimp in Chief adopted, and small wonder it annoys most anyone not from Texas.

Florida isn't really part of the south as it has been infiltrated by so many northern retirees over the decades.
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